219 age?

[220swift]

Hello, I just joined and am glad to be here. I have a 219, 30-30 made in Utica. Barrel is marked B MV, frame is MV, stock MV, and the butt plate is marked 7 and 23122. The barrel also has circle with what appears to be an S over B. The trigger guard is the black painted one. I have had this rifle since I was 12, and now I'm 71. I killed my first deer with it when I was 12 and this fall I killed a spike buck with it. It does not have a grooved barrel, but I do have a Bushnell Scopechief 2.5-8 on it. Stock is not cracked and in very good condition. I worked up a load with Speer 130gr HP's, and last time I checked zero I shot a .372 3 shot group with it. Forend is also very nice. I also have a 12ga barrel and forend that are very good. The 12ga is painful to shoot, so I don't shoot it. It also has -o- markings on it in various areas. Any info on this rifle would be appreciated. Thanks, Luke

[Garnett]

Luke, First....welcome to this forum!  The "B MV, MV, & MV" are assembly numbers and indicate the major parts have not been replaced since the gun left the factory.  Made at Utica with the alloy trigger guard, makes your gun what I call a "Second Model Utica".   The action has an internal "striker", NOT a hammer.  The gun is cocked when the top lever is moved to the right to open the action.  Starting with the M219B, the top lever only unlocked the action and the internal "hammer" was cocked when the barrel was opened.   The number "23122" on the butt plate is very unusual!  Is the butt plate plastic or steel?   I would really like to see a picture of this number.  I have never encountered this before.  I cannot explain the "S over B" in a circle, other than to say it could be either a proof mark or inspector's mark.  Is the 12 gauge barrel also marked with the "B MV"?  If so, you have a hard to find "Utility" gun.  If you can give me the length of the 12 gauge barrel, I can give you the factory model number assigned to "Utility" guns, even though the barrels are marked "219" and "220".  Your gun would have been made between 1937 and 1946, when production was moved to Chicopee Falls.  Production was halted around 1967 at Westfield, Mass. on all these models.   As to shooting the 12 gauge, I offer several suggestions.  Only shoot low brass shells, skeet loads, put one of those pull on recoil caps over the butt, or have a 1" solid recoil pad added to your stock WITHOUT cutting the stock.  This preserves the value and originality of the gun.   What is the length of pull on your stock?  It should be 14".  I have been told by other readers that these rifle barrels are very accurate.  If it is not too much trouble, please share a picture of the butt plate with the number on it.  You could either post it here, or send to my personal email:  garnettstancil@hotmail.com   Thanks again for sharing!  Merry Christmas!

[220swift]

Garnett, LOP is 13 3/4 inches. Butt plate is plastic. 12 ga barrel length 29 7/8". Barrel stamped with J over C E G. The C and E are circled. Barrel lug has a p with a large S around it (p inside the top of the S) with an oblong circle border around them. Barrel stamped; Savage, Savage Arms Corporation, Utica, New York U.S.A. Model 220. Proof tested 12 gauge, 2 3/4 inch chamber. Barrel mic's .694 at the muzzle. The shotgun forend is stamped B(hard to read) 35 that's clear. When the young folks get here for Christmas I will send you pictures. Thanks for the fast response and useful info. Merry Christmas, Luke

[Garnett]

Luke, thanks for the additional information.  Was the 12 gauge barrel with the gun when you got it at age 12?  These letters do not match the letters on the rest of the gun.  This leads me to believe it was not sold as a "Utility" gun.  However, in the early years, an extra barrel could be purchased with any gun for about $3.50 additional cost.  Does the rifle forend have a similar "B35" stamped inside it?  The oblong circle is the Savage proof mark.  The P inside the S is for "Proved" and there was a "T" in the bottom of the "S" for "Tested".  Sometimes these are worn or were lightly stamped and do not show up well.  I look forward to the pictures.  The butt plate really has me stumped!  Merry Christmas!

[220swift]

Garnett, They came together when we got them in or about 1957 from our neighbor who acquired them in the Madison, Wisc. area. The rifle forend has no markings. Thanks again, Luke

[Garnett]

Luke, because the 12 gauge letters don't match the rest of the gun, I think it was added to the original purchase of the rifle, but not a true "Utility" gun.   It doesn't really matter as it is still a nice set.  If your set is/or was a "Utility" gun,  the correct factory model number is "221".  These numbers were never marked on the guns but were marked on the end of the boxes and the hang tags.  I look forward to the pictures.  Best wishes, Garnett

[220swift]

Garnet, Did the pictures show yet? Luke

[Garnett]

Luke, I got your email, but no pictures attached.  Can you try again please?  Garnett

[220swift]

Garnett, We will try again, but if they don't show, send me your email address. Luke

[Garnett]

Luke, MERRY CHRISTMAS!  still no pictures.  my email is:  garnettstancil@hotmail.com      i look forward to the pictures.